China AATV

[pepper]

In my experience, I find that a lot of this stuff is built to be sold and that means cheap, not so much actually built to last. Looks good on the website showroom, but in reality needs to be babied and then thrown away and replaced every couple years.

The links you gave us show that this same factory builds toy R/C cars and robotic vacuum cleaners. As suggested by others- go ahead and try to order parts or tracks for the 8x8, or order 10 RC cars or robot vaccuum cleaners and see how many fail to work fresh out of the box. Also see if you get slapped with a 100% import duty by Canada Customs before getting in too deep.

Let us know how amazing a deal you get/how badly you get screwed so we can benefit from your experience.

I gotta say i am amused by your defensive response .
what makes you think that a design that has been floated about for over 30 years cant be duplicated LOL! they always used to say the same thing about japanese quality which had no choice but to improve just like chinese are now.

Look at how basic a design an argo is and try to tell me it cant be duplicated with the same quality of materials

You do realize we are living in 2008 right? even if china was 20 years behind the times it would still be on par with such a simple device. Argo is not exactly care free and they have quality control and longevity issues but do you think that those are one off problems or just plain old inferior Canadian workmanship?



Where do you get your import duty info from because that is a total fabrication on your part , you have proven yourself a person with no understanding of this matter and more then willing to make up stories to suit yourself.



when it comes to importing the vehicle the import duty on the item is 6% with applicable taxes of course. if you are to order parts the duty is 4.5% plus taxes.

It does not fall under RIV because it is considered a work vehicle and it seems transport Canada is hands off on this type of vehicle also ( no problem with its importation) so importing them does not seem to be an issue . It seems that this type of specialized vehicle is not a problem to import.
I will be doing more legwork to confirm everything but everything thus far looks positive. heck i have had several folks contact me from other boards i am on and express interest allready in regards to this.



Call the govt agencies your self for import info if you dont want to believe









wouldnt it be better to have more competition for these vehicles so they can get out of the dark ages and come out with a truly revoloutionary amphib for a better price? Unless of course you are an Argo dealer

[mudbug3]

" wouldnt it be better to have more competition for these vehicles so they can get out of the dark ages and come out with a truly revoloutionary amphib for a better price? Unless of course you are an Argo dealer "


pepper ,


I think competition would be good for both Argo and Recreatives . I for one , would like an amphib with more features and options . Matt Oxenders Mud Ox comes to mind .

[Bw6]

I Agree Pepper

I think this industry really needs competition, but it is such a relatively small market that the BIG BOYS are not interested in it. If a China copy-cat Argo can stimulate improvements and features, I'm all for it.

What about getting rid of those chains, and going to shaft drive? What about a better water propulsion system, to get some decent water speed? What about a PTO shaft to increase the utility for these vehicles? What about a decent suspension? What about a decent axle seal to eliminate water seepage?

These vehicles are like Quads were 20 years ago, or like the ultralights I flew around the same time. Meaning drive or fly 4 hours and adjust or fix for 8 hours.
I really love the sport, but improvements are really needed, this isn't high tech stuff we're talking about.

[6X6]

Pepper, I would recomend you buy it. You seem set on it, and have a very defensive response to any suggestions anyone else has (you don't work for the company or have an interest in their sales, do you?), so go for it. If it works great, great. If not, hopefully parts aren't hard to come by. Either way let everyone here know, because if it is a great buy, I'm sure a bunch of guys will be waiting to pick one up!

[pepper]

actually it is just that i have an open mind .
Vancouver has a huge dealing with china and we see many items that are chinese imports.

We have a great deal of our population from asia many are affluent bussiness people that are familier with and take advantadge of asian manufacturing and import it into NA . this has been going on here for a very long time.

An example I know of first hand is a local company had a product that was made here and they started to explore haveing them made in China. They had strict guidlines and material grades that had to be adhered to as well as quality control .

Some asian companies could not make the product as required ( some attempts were high school quality) but eventually a company with the proper tooling was able to meet the requirments and quality control criteria for a saveings after all was said and done of about 40%, yes some folks lost positions of employment here but it proves the fact that quality products can come out of Asia even China. This sort of thing is happening all the time here.



As for this Machine . if it is anything like other chinese products , they are made to set minimum and very often imposed by the purchaser or market requirments.

I am trying to get better specs on the machine such as chain, gear ratios who actually makes the engine etc how thick the body is etc . Not yet ready to jump in with both feet but i would never be so silly as to rule it out simply because it is made in China .

For the price it is a controlled gamble to purchase one for testing , it could either be a a winner or a loser but that can only be decided on actually being able to see and use it . also if one is purchased and it is found lacking if someone were incline they would specify what they would want on the machine and very often the company would manufacture to customer specifications.

the key is to have an open mind .

As with all things nothing ventured nothing Gained


If i told you about a machine that was made in mexico would you be more or less suspect? how about an eastern block machine? get past the fact that it is a chinese machine and see it for just a mechanical device


I have no interest in the company other then a good deal . Unlike Americans who have better options and priceing on almost every mechanized item , Canadians dont have that choice and in order to make our money go further we have to be open to other ideas and options . (even Argos are more here then in the US and its made here) .

How can this not be a win win situation?
if the machines are a hit but reliability sucks then Argo or Max could step in and offer the same options but better quality. If the machine proves to be of good quality then Argo and max will either have to get more competitive by offering more machine for the money in one way or another. (seriously how much could they screw up such a simple machine?)

The concept of capitalizm is in effect here is it not?

in the end we as a consumer are the ones that benifit from healthy competition



ps
This company is allready selling in the US and has been for some time just not this particular product .

[bostatv]

Chinese made everything

Good Evening Gentlemen,

Seems that the Chinese market has caught up to our AATV market. There was a time that the automobile from Japan was considered to be junk and was made out of American beer cans but today take a look at a Lexus. Quite a bit of quality involved with the vehicle. For over 5 years I have handled a very powerful electric vehicle and in the beginning the vehicles were not without mutli problems. One issue which comes to mind is the nuts and bolts which never seemed to fit each other. Five years latter the company is producing a very quality and reliable product with little to no problems. This is partly because the design is American and the quality control is also controled by a US controled company. But now the product is more inline with the US market for a comparable vehicle. When products are built and controled from China then the end result may not be what you would like it to be. As far as the Argo products go I have always felt they were over priced for the entire 30 years I have been associated with them but there is little to no compitition other than the Max vehicles which vehicle for vehicle are comparably priced. I have been in the Auto repair business for nearly 40 years and there was a time that I went to GM for GM parts and what I got was All American parts but not today. The GM part may say made in Mexico or a number of other countries. I do feel that an 8x8 vehicle from China at this time with out the proper quality control will be a huge mistake. Now given a few years the vehicles may be worth what you pay for it but most likely the more realistic figure will be much closer the the cost of our 8x8 and 6x6 vehicles we are used to in our country. Generally you do get what you pay for. Everyone have a great day and where ever we go we Argo.

Ken

[Cougar]

well i just got the price for the 8x8 with the 52 hp engine 25 inch tires and the CVT - with 3spd+rev trans and it was $7800 CIF to vancouver (That Cost ,Insurance & Freight) and tracks for the 8x8 are 200 dollars a set . judgeing by all the reports on China products gettiing better and better to meet world standards . this particular company is ISO 9001.2000 and interestingly thier products have passed the EU product safety certification,EEC, CE and EPA/DOT certs. (some of thier items are rebadged).

I think this is a gamble that i might be willing to take. the tracks alone are tempting.

I looked all over on both links for a price on tracks, but I couldn't find any info on them or on a top and windshield. It looks like they might fit on a Argo. Cougar

[mightymaxIV]

Chinese AATV

Pepper-it's just my opinion but I believe that the Chinese will do everything in their power to make you happy. I have noticed that Chinese companies are very responsive to fixing problems and they listen to what you have to say. They do not hesitate to upgrade or make something better if the orignal doesn't do the job. They are new to this market and I am sure they want to make a dent. I believe that The three cylinder engine in this machine is the same 800 to 1000cc engine they use in there small work trucks and it's almost bullet proof. It might not be perfect when you buy it but I am sure it will be well tested and that they will work with you on every problem. A 3 speed transmission is what every max owner would love to have. Tracks that fit over big tires and give you traction and ground clearance? How can you go wrong, what more could you ask for? Best of luck

[SWAMP HAWG]

Any new info on this machine??

[LarryW]

Well as the chinese stuff goes, my attex 208tt is powered buy a chinese honda copy 16hp engine. The same as the gx13hp with bigger bore/stroke. It has been a great engine and starts up with ease even in zero degree weather. Put choke on and pull the cord and it starts, in any weather and even if sitting for a month. It doesnt start as quick with the electric start though, think it dont spin as fast. I had a problem with the cooling fan exploding and they sent me a new one with no questions asked and they paid the shipping. I have been happy with it. I hate to say it but it is true.
I have also found that people here cheat on there jobs. They are lazy. Skipping steps. Doing nothing on on the clock. etc...... That kind of people cost the company they work for extra money and in turn they have to raise the price of there product. blah blah blah.
I know someone working for a company who was manufacturing the roller rockers for comp cams. During testing the needle bearings where seizing up. They where told to ship them anyways. We all need to quit this stuff. It will catch up to us all. The chinese are starting to make a name of better quality then they had year ago. This is serious stuff.
Sorry for all that but I do feel better, lol.

LarryW

[mudbug3]

[QUOTE ]
I have also found that people here cheat on there jobs. They are lazy. Skipping steps. Doing nothing on on the clock. etc...... That kind of people cost the company they work for extra money and in turn they have to raise the price of there product. blah blah blah.
I know someone working for a company who was manufacturing the roller rockers for comp cams. During testing the needle bearings where seizing up. They where told to ship them anyways. We all need to quit this stuff. It will catch up to us all. The chinese are starting to make a name of better quality then they had year ago. This is serious stuff. [ QUOTE]


LarryW

I hate to agree with you , but I have seen this happen quite often in the GM factory where I work . This is nothing new though , it happens " quite often " in all the big US auto and truck manufactoring plants here in the US , that have a VERY large union and thousands of workers who pay union dues to support it.

I also agree with you and others that have posted about the chinese getting a foot hold in the US economy , and over the long haul , beating us at our own game , just like the Japanese have done . Thats why Toyota is now the worlds largest auto and truck builder in the world .

[riotwarrior]

Well regardless of where they are made I would purchase a set of tracks....I think that would be ideal for the price to use as an experiment in QC of their products.

Pepper, let me know if you go through with an order please. As I live in BC too, I would consider the purchase of a set of tracks to be an investment and would be happy to let you negotiate that if you could.

If you do not purchase, I may eventually do so myself.

I looked all over the web site and ya those machines look good.....it is hard to say if they are good....

Kinda like where I work at the Pub...

Going home at 2 with a 10
Waking up at 10 with a 2

[AKTrail]

Question: What is a half-price argo?

Answer: A Max 4!

Mine will go 25 mph on the flat stuff without three forward gears. I do hope this machine weighs around the same as a Max... or many governments and management areas will disallow them.

I am more interested in hoping the people at RI start putting out units with better and better engines etc. I hope the competition stimulates some r&d from American companies.

[Bushman]

Looks like junk to me!

All I have to say is that a lot of Americans died fighting the Chinese in Korea and we are still keeping an eye on them at the DMZ.

This Chinese crook company stole Argos design and was not even shy about making the plastic look the same. What makes you think that they care if they sell you a piece of crap. You have no recourse to try and recover any money if damages occur. Ontario Drive and Gear spent alot of loonies engineering their ATVs and these crooks just stole from them. ODG is a international company with scope and they know a thing or two about liability and patent infringements. They cant stop these Chinese pirates.

Good luck if you buy one of those Chinese Junks.

I would hope someone would consider buying a used ATV made by a honest company before contributing to the Communist Pirates.

There is a Russian company that makes another Argo Clone called the Beetle, I have a picture somewhere. The Industrial Company from Murom, I believe makes it.

Bushman

[Roger S]